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Ivan
Known Hero
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posted April 27, 2011 01:44 PM |
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Feanor, it's great to see perfectionism, but I'm afraid you're aiming for the stars. At this pace, you guys would take several years to complete the project if you keep trying to create everything anew. Besides, you've greatly departed from the original NWC concepts already. I suggest you use what data turned up in the meantime. Like every team that we've had so far, you too would abandon the project once you've realized that it's way harder to complete than it looks. Take a look at Bastion, Cathedral, Vori, Cove and countless other projects that were abandoned even though they seemed to be a few steps from completion. Like Zielevitz said, if you take up a project that takes years to complete you're likely to get fed up with it and abandon it. You should go for something simpler for starters and than improve and polish it later on.
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Dj
Promising
Supreme Hero
Always loyal to HC
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posted April 27, 2011 01:49 PM |
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i agree with you Ivan but i would bet my life on the fact that Cove and Bastion are still being worked on! that's 100% sure. They will be finished.
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted April 27, 2011 02:15 PM |
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Lurkers advices not always good to follow. The main reason is that serious people who work on new projects do not aim in first place to a release date, but firstly being satisfied with the quality. Of course, lurkers keep asking for a release date and become aggressive more the time goes by. It is not a paid work, you know?
The idea that a project, once out, can be polished afterwards, it is false. If the first impression is bad, the afterwards becomes postmortem.
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Dj
Promising
Supreme Hero
Always loyal to HC
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posted April 27, 2011 02:18 PM |
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we have facts...real examples salamandre. Grove town is one of them. VCMI is the second big example. your argument is based on?
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted April 27, 2011 02:31 PM |
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The polish grove is the happy exception, but I will not dig inside the subject much, because myself I did not enjoy the graphics (creatures) enough to keep me interested for an update. VCMI is unplayable, and the only reason they keep releasing updates is because they need testers and adrenaline to keep working.
The best quality I saw so far was the bastion town, which looks like coming out from a professional company. But the people working on gave up on Heroes long time ago, I guess.
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OxFEA
Promising
Famous Hero
feanor on DF2.ru
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posted April 27, 2011 02:52 PM |
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Quote:
Grove town is one of them.
Yes, it's example of bad first impression.
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Warmonger
Promising
Legendary Hero
fallen artist
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posted April 27, 2011 03:00 PM |
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Quote:
The idea that a project, once out, can be polished afterwards, it is false. If the first impression is bad, the afterwards becomes postmortem.
I agree. We had exactly same discussion about our (and past) projects. If you show something that in not avaliable, people get frustrated. If you show something that is incomplete or buggy, people start to hate it (though I could hardly recall a project that would make some sense by now and got released too early).
In VCMI we stated clearly that it's not finished, though you may observe and help in its development. I believe opinions would be much more harsh if I said it's already finished and everybody should use it.
Lots of people visit this board only to ask "Is 3.58 / HoTA / VCMI released? I want to download it now!". Even if no one ever said they are. It's hard to understand the difference between nice town images and ready mod, much harder than understand than our engine is just not a plate of cookies for everyone 
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The future of Heroes 3 is here!
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Ivan
Known Hero
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posted April 27, 2011 10:41 PM |
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Dj, technically you're right. They are "still being worked on", but whenever someone askes the developers about the release date every few months they always reply that they're "still working on it" and that goes on forever.
I don't want to criticize or be negative, but I'm afraid that Don's/Feanor's team is a little too ambitious without the dedication to back it up - they want to make a perfect Forge from scratch, but haven't come up with anything new for months now. I'd love to see them succeed, but what are the chances of it, even if they don't abandon the project in the long meantime?
Things should be kept simpler in order that at least something be accomplished. With the old data that we have (pages 75-76), someone skilled enough should just gather it all and release a basic version of it, replacing Necropolis that would play a minor role in the original AB anyway, seeing as the faction located in Deyja would be the Forge, the Necromancers having been driven to Clanker's Lab.
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Salubri
Adventuring Hero
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posted May 14, 2011 09:06 PM |
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Ok so what do we have? Someone posted town files so we have all the buildings except for oil pump. There is a puzzle map and two loading screens (one with stinger and other with cyber dead). Few creatures. Poorly looking goblin, better looking cyber dead and perfectly made pyro and pyromaniac (Glory for those who made pyro and pyromaniac look so good). Yeah there are other creatures posted like stinger, jump soldier and tank but they look tragic. I never saw a juggernaut so we still missing some creatures. There are only 4 heroes. Yeah 3 pictures from MM7 (Kastore,Maximus and Dark Shade) and the final one was perfectly made by the team and posted here. We still need a battlefield when castle is under siege. We can skip campaign because i think 99% people here just want to play new castle and not the campaign because we know the ending. So bottom line is that team needs a little bit more time at least to make all the creatures and then u can realease a demo. One more thing. Don't replace necropolis, i love necropolis, not all necromancers left Deyja only Archibald with his followers. Forge needs necromancers for cyber dead. Better replace conflux or inferno because kreegan are eliminated and elements are gone after MM8 events.
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Ivan
Known Hero
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posted May 15, 2011 11:49 PM |
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Edited by Ivan at 23:59, 15 May 2011.
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True enough, the Inferno could be replaced just as well as the Necropolis (with their technology, I don't think the technicians of the Forge would need the Necromancers to create cyborgs from corpses - think of Kane and his Cyborg army in the C&C Tiberium Wars expansion, Kane's Wrath).
The Elemental Conflux, however, is an entirely different matter: don't forget that it was quickly pieced together when the "fans" demanded that Forge be removed. M&M 8 takes place *after* AB, so in the original storyline the Conflux would never have existed, and the elementals would simply remain the unimportant neutral monsters that they were to begin with. This would make replacing the Conflux the most "canonical" implementation of the Forge.
Actually, there was a level 7 unit model (see page 24), but nobody (except me  ) liked it.
With what we have, finishing the project woundn't be that hard, but the problem is that Feanor's team doesn't want to use the old data. They want to create almost everything from scrap which would take way too long and is very unlikely to succeed.
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Salubri
Adventuring Hero
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posted May 17, 2011 04:37 PM |
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U can't compare Kane's Wrath and Heroes. Kane's cyborgs are more advanced and it takes nano technology to revive them. Forge is only a novice in this new technology and their way of building is different. I mean look at a Stinger, such a huge rocket launcher and fumes are coming out of it so that means it is petroleum powered everything Forge has it is petroleum powered (look at a cyber dead it also has tubes for fumes to come out because engine is responsible for hand movement and saws). Their technology is very simple compared to Kane's. So the juggernaut has to be something like Avatar from Kane's Wrath but imperfect. U know like rusty parts, tubes for fumes to come out because it has a big imperfect engine powered by petroleum. Just look at assasin droid from MM7 analyze it. Look at it's legs and construction. Yeah it's engine is different because it's Ancients technology but still it has the same built style like Forge. So what i think the only thing The Forge needs is to remake units because remade pyro looks way better than original. Next a castle siege battlefield and heroes portraits.
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OxFEA
Promising
Famous Hero
feanor on DF2.ru
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posted May 17, 2011 05:10 PM |
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Quote:
So what i think the only thing The Forge needs is to remake units because remade pyro looks way better than original. Next a castle siege battlefield and heroes portraits.
Units, siege screen, heroes..what more do you want?)
Town screen already done. And implemented in game.
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Vade_Parvis
Known Hero
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posted June 21, 2011 11:02 PM |
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Any news (apart from the Factory-like bomb launcher in the Possible Creatures)?
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Vade_Parvis
Known Hero
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posted June 29, 2011 05:29 AM |
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The final version of my Factory/Forge-style bomb launcher is ready:
Details — in the Possible Creature thread.
P.S. This is not crosspost — just the sprite primarily for the Forge thematics, and in "Possible Creature" it might miss.
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Salubri
Adventuring Hero
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posted June 29, 2011 05:50 PM |
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Quote:
The final version of my Factory/Forge-style bomb launcher is ready:
Details — in the Possible Creature thread.
P.S. This is not crosspost — just the sprite primarily for the Forge thematics, and in "Possible Creature" it might miss.
Is this one from Warlords Battlecry 3? Dark Dwarf faction.
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Vade_Parvis
Known Hero
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posted June 29, 2011 08:18 PM |
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Ivan
Known Hero
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posted June 30, 2011 12:09 AM |
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Well, it's certainly a very steampunkish-looking cannon, but I don't think it fits the overall hi-tech Forge Equipment. Some portable Plasma or Ion Cannon should have been made instead, to bring it up to par with other weaponry - blasters, flamethrowers, cybernetics, etc.
Also, the Forge's siege weapon obviously shouldn't be a regular catapult.
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted June 30, 2011 06:33 AM |
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I know no way to have a different catapult or balista regardless the faction. How will work then?
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Warmonger
Promising
Legendary Hero
fallen artist
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posted June 30, 2011 06:38 AM |
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Quote:
Some portable Plasma or Ion Cannon should have been made instead
Good god, save us! 
Well done, Vade_Parvis. Don't listen to these diabolic whispers.
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The future of Heroes 3 is here!
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lelarandi
Tavern Dweller
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posted June 30, 2011 01:02 PM |
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While it's unlikely that we'll ever see a futuristic forge town in the game, a low-tech forge, maybe using clockwork and steam-technology or a combination of them, might be more realistic.
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